temp 250-300 more towards the lower...rOcH wrote:Whether the cost is justified depend much what motivate you to have it.
The WOW factor to me is sufficient to justify the cost, effort and time to have it. Just too bad, my pocket not deep enough for this upgrade
Most bros on drum are using project miu bestop shoe brake (temp 400?). Most got it from stamford. You can try your luck looking for one pair there.
Rear disc conversion for ES - Done!
DDM
Re: Rear brakes
An ES is not the fastest saloon car nor is it the slowest... You can only stress on handling and an expect of it is the brake system. With drums I am unable to hld speeds as late as I wld have wanted to. Cost and benefit ratio Justifies every bit on having a rear set up. I have another 2 other bros with set ups from DC2 and ET (2ltr set up from Msia and Tland plug and play and costing least 1k brand new w/o install). Rarity to see rear set ups done as most here associate cost first. Pity...Hysteria4u wrote:Thanks everyone. Sounds like the cost - benefit ratio does not justify it.
Heck, I'll stick to the drums for now... till I find them a limiting factor. How about better drum brake shoes? Anything better (i.e. more 'jiat') than stock?
Thank you.
DDM
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Importance of rear brakes
Dude,
I agree totally. That's why I choose to use polyurethane bushings and use coilovers and use a larger rear ARB as I am aware of what I need to make the ES handle better, IMHO, and based on my limited skills. I am still learning. I will try the bestop shoes for the rear drums and higher temp pads for the font (currently using bestop) and then test it on the track to see if the drums become a limiting factor. For dums, cooling is the key issue. when they overheat, the drums become less effective and the fronts have a larger burden. So knowing the limitations of the car (horsepower, braking, suspension, tyres) and being able to drive to the limit in a safe manner, that is the goal.
I agree totally. That's why I choose to use polyurethane bushings and use coilovers and use a larger rear ARB as I am aware of what I need to make the ES handle better, IMHO, and based on my limited skills. I am still learning. I will try the bestop shoes for the rear drums and higher temp pads for the font (currently using bestop) and then test it on the track to see if the drums become a limiting factor. For dums, cooling is the key issue. when they overheat, the drums become less effective and the fronts have a larger burden. So knowing the limitations of the car (horsepower, braking, suspension, tyres) and being able to drive to the limit in a safe manner, that is the goal.
Agree. The project miu drum shoe i think is below 500 deg. Can't really recall if it is 450deg or 400degDaDude wrote:temp 250-300 more towards the lower...rOcH wrote:Whether the cost is justified depend much what motivate you to have it.
The WOW factor to me is sufficient to justify the cost, effort and time to have it. Just too bad, my pocket not deep enough for this upgrade
Most bros on drum are using project miu bestop shoe brake (temp 400?). Most got it from stamford. You can try your luck looking for one pair there.
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actually drum brake more "jiak" than disc brake, u see those car that can do handbrake turn - they are on drum brake. Rear disc brake cannot do handbrake turn, but they offers the following advantages:
1. Reaction time - i personally feels (note: in theory, it may not be true) that disc brake more responsive than drum brake. Once u step on the brake pedal, your car comes to a halt immediately. But it is more jerky as a result. Drum brake offers smoother deceleration, but slower reaction time.
2. Looks - disc brake is nicer as compared to drum.
As for heat management part, don't worry about that. Your front brake will fade first before your rear brake, due to the brake distribution (something like 70% front 30% rear). There was once my front rotor (282mm) warped due to some hard braking on the track. So if you are worried about heat management, then upgrade your front brake instead. The more "pots" the better for caliper and the larger the rotor the better.
Btw, i am on the ES3 rear disc setup. Upgraded due to the looks of it. Hahahaha.
1. Reaction time - i personally feels (note: in theory, it may not be true) that disc brake more responsive than drum brake. Once u step on the brake pedal, your car comes to a halt immediately. But it is more jerky as a result. Drum brake offers smoother deceleration, but slower reaction time.
2. Looks - disc brake is nicer as compared to drum.
As for heat management part, don't worry about that. Your front brake will fade first before your rear brake, due to the brake distribution (something like 70% front 30% rear). There was once my front rotor (282mm) warped due to some hard braking on the track. So if you are worried about heat management, then upgrade your front brake instead. The more "pots" the better for caliper and the larger the rotor the better.
Btw, i am on the ES3 rear disc setup. Upgraded due to the looks of it. Hahahaha.
Rear set up cannot do handbrake turn...?!?!?! Better go check your install man! drum more jiak than disc... hmmm... Mines si beh jiak... pull it a little already jam... as for brake fade, its normal leh... you try hard braking with a drum vs disc... more often than not... disc will prevail...
My take on looks... well, looks are always a must, but, to tell you the truth, more often than not ppl do not notice rear disc... I for one, do not even care to notice them at all... maybe a 6 or 8pot on the larger scale, up front, even than I still do not bother bout the rears. Its other facial mods that mostly get the attention...
Agree front rotors and calipers take the brunt of the braking... If you are still on the prelude rotors, you might want to upgrade your rotors to better spec ones... My problem now is rotor wear... as my pads keep eating them. Done a few sets since. I guess its the price you pay for using hi temp pads and rotors...
My take on looks... well, looks are always a must, but, to tell you the truth, more often than not ppl do not notice rear disc... I for one, do not even care to notice them at all... maybe a 6 or 8pot on the larger scale, up front, even than I still do not bother bout the rears. Its other facial mods that mostly get the attention...
Agree front rotors and calipers take the brunt of the braking... If you are still on the prelude rotors, you might want to upgrade your rotors to better spec ones... My problem now is rotor wear... as my pads keep eating them. Done a few sets since. I guess its the price you pay for using hi temp pads and rotors...
DDM
Re: Importance of rear brakes
You're on the right track dude... You might want to have better cambers done to your front and rear... and a point to note (front) bestop pads are ok only... you might want to go higher temps and give em a try... a track test will justify most of your braking needs.. most here who go sepang, like MCDS, roch, etc etc... are on drums and they are fine on the braking dept.Hysteria4u wrote:Dude,
I agree totally. That's why I choose to use polyurethane bushings and use coilovers and use a larger rear ARB as I am aware of what I need to make the ES handle better, IMHO, and based on my limited skills. I am still learning. I will try the bestop shoes for the rear drums and higher temp pads for the font (currently using bestop) and then test it on the track to see if the drums become a limiting factor. For dums, cooling is the key issue. when they overheat, the drums become less effective and the fronts have a larger burden. So knowing the limitations of the car (horsepower, braking, suspension, tyres) and being able to drive to the limit in a safe manner, that is the goal.
All said, some here know a Pg King ES or now changed to a Sepang King CTR... hahaha... that he hardly used brakes in PG and now in Sepang... kekeke...
DDM
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Let me give my side of the story.
A lot of the ES bro here usually are worried about
1)Cost
2)Will the upgrade cost any problems
3)Adopt a Wait and see for Guinea Pigs first to test out the system first
I think I was one of the first on Rear EP3 ES Brakes? Yes I did encounter problems (Example ABS ring not fabricated, which cost my ABS to keep kicking in)
But luckily, the problems were solved finally after trial and Error.
I will say that the Rear Disc are good compared to drums, reason because of the Prelude brakes upgrade thrown off the brake biasing which in turn cause nose drive for the car.
A lot of the ES bro here usually are worried about
1)Cost
2)Will the upgrade cost any problems
3)Adopt a Wait and see for Guinea Pigs first to test out the system first
I think I was one of the first on Rear EP3 ES Brakes? Yes I did encounter problems (Example ABS ring not fabricated, which cost my ABS to keep kicking in)
But luckily, the problems were solved finally after trial and Error.
I will say that the Rear Disc are good compared to drums, reason because of the Prelude brakes upgrade thrown off the brake biasing which in turn cause nose drive for the car.
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i am referring to those car-park races where u need drum brake to do a 90degree or greater hand-brake turn, unlike drifting where u create oversteer to slide your car around...so far every workshop has been telling me that u need drum brake for those car park races, rear disc brake can't do itrOcH wrote:I thought those drift cars are on rear disc brake?
Which type of rear disc setup is yours????
Quite a while never see you liao
Yeah, its been a long time since i last tracked at SIC ... expensive hobby and somemore economy not doing well and hence, got to watch my pocket.
i m on the m'sia ES3 rear disc setup, the one that just need to plug and play...no modification needed.
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Re: Importance of rear brakes
DaDude wrote:You're on the right track dude... You might want to have better cambers done to your front and rear... and a point to note (front) bestop pads are ok only... you might want to go higher temps and give em a try... a track test will justify most of your braking needs.. most here who go sepang, like MCDS, roch, etc etc... are on drums and they are fine on the braking dept.
All said, some here know a Pg King ES or now changed to a Sepang King CTR... hahaha... that he hardly used brakes in PG and now in Sepang... kekeke...
Re: Importance of rear brakes
roadrunner wrote:DaDude wrote:You're on the right track dude... You might want to have better cambers done to your front and rear... and a point to note (front) bestop pads are ok only... you might want to go higher temps and give em a try... a track test will justify most of your braking needs.. most here who go sepang, like MCDS, roch, etc etc... are on drums and they are fine on the braking dept.
All said, some here know a Pg King ES or now changed to a Sepang King CTR... hahaha... that he hardly used brakes in PG and now in Sepang... kekeke...
~ dR|vE L|ke HeLL & YoU'LL bE tHeRe ~
Re: Importance of rear brakes
Both kachiao lah,...ay0mz wrote:roadrunner wrote:DaDude wrote:You're on the right track dude... You might want to have better cambers done to your front and rear... and a point to note (front) bestop pads are ok only... you might want to go higher temps and give em a try... a track test will justify most of your braking needs.. most here who go sepang, like MCDS, roch, etc etc... are on drums and they are fine on the braking dept.
All said, some here know a Pg King ES or now changed to a Sepang King CTR... hahaha... that he hardly used brakes in PG and now in Sepang... kekeke...
DDM
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Re: Importance of rear brakes
Now that you mentioned the "Devil", all the creeps and toyol start to come.DaDude wrote:Both kachiao lah,...ay0mz wrote:roadrunner wrote: